MEMBERS OFFICERS

O. J. Roberts (Chairman)

S. Atkins

I. ap Dewi

I. V. Andrews

D. A. Brown

M. R. Boyce

T. R. Glover

 W. Cook

Members declared their interest in Agenda items as follows:-

Item 3 – Seed mussel movements. Mr. D. Jewitt, Mr. Mr. K. Mould, Mrs. M. Owen, Mr. C. Woods.

Item 4 – Byelaw 1 applications. Mr. D. Jewitt, Mr. K. Mould, Mrs. M. Owen, Mr. C. Woods.

Item 5 - Tope: Response to consultation. Mr. G. Hancock, Mr. A. Marklew.

Item 6 – Bass Policy. Mr. G. Hancock, Mr. D. Jewitt, Mr. A. Marklew, Mrs. M. Owen.

Item 7 – Scalloping in Wales. Mr. A. Jones, Mr. T. Watson.

Item 8 – Management of the whelk fishery. Mr. R. J. Gorman, Mr. A. Jones

Item 9 – Management of the prawn fishery. Mr. R. J. Gorman, Mr. K. Mould

Item 10 – Skate and ray conservation. Mr. A. Jones, Mr. A. Marklew

Item 11 – Razor fishery – Liverpool Bay. Mr. T. Watson.

Item 12 – Lobster MLS consultation. Mr. R. J. Gorman.

Item 13 – Fish catches at Heysham Power Station. Mr. D. Jewitt, Mrs. M. Owen.

Item 14 – Fishery Orders: Progress Report. Mr. C. Woods

The Senior Scientific Officer updated Members on authorisations to harvest and relay seed mussels in the District in 2006. In Morecambe Bay seed mussel harvesting had initially been authorised on the Falklands area. In early September authorisations were issued for the South America skear. Dredging had been successful with 10,000 tonnes being taken from that area. The relaying of mussels for overwintering onto Ballast Bank had been successfully carried out. Half the stock would be removed for relaying in the Menai Strait with the remainder being left for hand-gathering. A similar operation had been agreed for the Conwy fishery, and 750 tonnes of mussels had been relayed here. Conwy had received a very poor spatfall over the past two to three years but had seen a good spatfall this year.

English Nature had agreed to the relaying of 2,500 tonnes of seed mussels along the west side of Foulney Twist, adjacent to the Walney Channel for overwintering. To date 800 tonnes had been relayed and it was hoped to make up the shortfall by taking seed mussels from the South America skear. To date there had been no relaying of seed in the Ring Hole area.

Mr. Mould advised Members that most of the mussels had now gone from South America.

The Senior Scientific Officer presented the report informing Members of increasing interest in Byelaw 1 authorisations in Morecambe Bay and to recommend a policy for issuing those authorisations. This item related to the previous one on seed mussel movements and the application to experimentally relay mussels adjacent to existing mussel beds off Morecambe under Byelaw 1. Members were reminded that Byelaw 1 allows fishing for scientific, stocking and relaying purposes.

Two further Byelaw 1 applications were received subsequent to the September Joint Committee meeting for experimental mussel cultivation and harvesting at areas near Bare and on the east side of Foulney Island. The Committee presently had no policy on the use of Byelaw 1 and what constituted scientific experiment and Officers were suggesting that such a policy should be defined. It was proposed that authorisations for Byelaw 1 mussel relaying should be for a maximum of 500 tonnes of mussels over a maximum area of 20 hectares for each experiment.

Mr. Woods raised concerns about seed mussel gathering by hand rakers and whether those areas would be kept for and utilised by those hand gatherers. He felt that the hand gathering sector had declined over the years by lack of enforcement and he would not wish to see a situation escalating to a point that would affect hand gatherers even more in the future.

The Principal Fishery Officer said that hand raking activity needed to continue and new areas identified to those traditionally fished.

Following further discussion it was

The Chief Executive introduced the report on the current consultation from DEFRA and NAW on the management and exploitation of tope. Members were reminded that the Committee had previously resolved to introduce a byelaw to control the landing of all tope. Since that resolution DEFRA and NAW had brought out their own consultation. A draft response to that consultation was provided at Annex A to the report. If recreational sea anglers fishing from boats and the shore were not covered by any new measures for the management of tope Officers were suggesting that the Committee develop a byelaw to bring in similar controls for that sector. A draft byelaw was provided at Annex A to the report for Members’ comments. Information on the scale of tope fishing within the District had been sought from the Committee’s Fishery Officers and that information would be included in the response to the DEFRA and NAW consultation. If any Member had comments they wished to be included in the response these should be submitted to the Chief Executive within the next few days.

The Chief Executive provided a verbal report on the consultation from DEFRA to the proposal to increase the minimum landing size for bass to 40cm with a mesh size of 100mm. Members were advised that WAG wished to increase the minimum landing size of bass in Wales to 37.5cm whilst the European MLS remains at 36cm. The proposed measures would result in Fishery Officers having to enforce three different sizes within the District. Members were advised that the NFFO had launched a campaign for the 40cm bass MLS in England to be overturned. No action was required from the Committee at present but it may be needed in due course dependent on what decision is reached by DEFRA and NAW.

Members were advised that the Association of SFCs had discussed the bass consultation at its meeting in September. Government would be asked for assistance with the additional enforcement costs that the measures are likely to impose.

Members’ views were sought on the question of bag limits. It was felt that a bag limit was part and parcel of a full management scheme. Most countries had bag limits for recreational fishermen and anyone interested in a sustainable fishery could not object to the introduction of such a limit. Following a discussion it was agreed that a bag limit of 2 would be reasonable.

That the report be received.

Mr. Alwyn Jones presented a letter from scallop fishermen from the Llyn Peninsula area, which had been handed out to all Members today. This was in respect of Byelaw 12 authorisations and the advice from CCW.

The Senior Scientific Officer pointed out that under the Habitats legislation authorisations issued under the Committee’s Byelaw 12 were considered a plan or project and as such the likely effects on the SAC would need to be assessed and conservation advice sought before any activity took place. The Committee had a duty to listen to that advice and if the restricted areas were not maintained, there was risk of significant damage to the SAC. The North Llyn Modiolus area was one of the most important in the UK. Modiolus was a slow growing and long-lived species. Advice from CCW was that the proposed scallop dredging should not affect the integrity of the SAC provided that the areas where dredging is currently prohibited were retained for the forthcoming season.

Members were advised that in the Tremadog Bay area, adjacent to the small trawling ground, there was an area that had been surveyed as a juvenile lobster release site. This was a good lobster habitat and it was considered that any incursion by scallop dredging would be devastating. Officers were recommending that Byelaw 12 authorisations should be issued for 2006/07, retaining the present closed areas as last season.

Dr. Lockwood said it was unfortunate that Dr. Mike Kaiser, an acknowledged world expert on this subject, had not been able to attend today’s meeting. He accepted the advice given by CCW and Officers and supported the recommendation put to the Committee but proposed an amendment to that recommendation that as the letter from the Llyn fishermen appeared to attack the personal and scientific integrity of the Committee’s Officers, this should be repudiated by a vote of confidence.

Mr. Alwyn Jones pointed out that he was one of the few fishermen that relied on scalloping for his income. The introduction of the Welsh Scallop Order put management beyond that of anywhere else in the UK. He advised Members of a situation in Lyme Bay where following representation to the Fisheries Minister, scalloping activity in that area had been allowed to continue as long as sensitive areas were avoided. Mr. Jones advised Members that an independent scientist had looked at the evidence provided by the Llyn fishermen, which had been passed on to the Committee. The fishermen had also offered to take observers on board their fishing vessels. The Llyn fishermen were asking the Committee to either back the proposal to be allowed to fish within the current closed area or form a Sub-Committee to look at their grievances.

Mr. Gorman felt that the Committee should identify beds traditionally worked and let them be opened. He considered that the scientific advice provided by CCW had not been well thought out and not detailed enough to disrupt livelihoods. The Committee could disregard the advice and open the area and he suggested that the Committee was not be seen to be acting in good faith if this was not done.

The Principal Fishery Officer handed out a map showing areas fished by scallop dredgers off North Wales and Cardigan Bay, compiled from Byelaw 12 returns and logged observations of the patrol boat and enforcement staff, which might be helpful to those Members not familiar with the areas involved. Mr. Gorman pointed out that the area off Cardigan was worked for potting for part of the year and for scallops for the remainder of the year.

Mr. Watson advised Members that he had spoken to DEFRA, who were running a number of fisheries science workshops, about the possibility of running a workshop on this matter. This would involve a two to three week programme with CEFAS scientists and fishermen, followed by discussions with CCW in a more non-political way.

The Chief Executive expressed concern at the inference in the Llyn fishermen’s letter that Officers were showing bias towards the views of CCW. He advised Members that at a meeting with CCW on 19^th October a lengthy discussion had taken place on this matter. It was felt necessary on occasions to support that agency in the advice they put forward.

It was proposed, and agreed, that the Committee should pursue the idea of the fisheries science workshop run by DEFRA. It was suggested that Dr. Mike Kaiser should be involved in that workshop.

Members were reminded of the recommendations, and of the proposed amendment. As a result of the discussion that had been held Dr. Lockwood was satisfied that his concerns had been aired and withdrew the amendment.

A show of hands followed, with one Member against and it was

Mr. Alwyn Jones was asked to provide a verbal report on the management of the whelk fishery. He expressed concerns that the Caernarfon Bay fishery could be fished 12 months a year and was being over-exploited. Fishermen would like to see a closed season for whelks for perhaps two months of the year around December and early New Year.

It was suggested that fishermen be consulted on a closed season for whelks by means of a questionnaire, with a report back to the Joint Committee, and this was agreed.

The Principal Fishery Officer presented his report appraising Members of widespread discussions being held in Cardigan Bay on future management plans for the Welsh prawn fishery. Officers were becoming concerned at the increase in effort along the Welsh coast at present. The Welsh Federation of Fishermen’s Associations had produced a discussion paper, which agreed with concerns expressed by Fishery Officers. It was proposed that any restrictions should cover the whole of Wales and discussions were being held with South Wales SFC on this point.

It was suggested that the WFFA discussion paper be reinforced with information from local fishermen. It was hoped that sufficient information could be obtained in time to submit a report to the December meeting of the Joint Committee.

That the report be received.

11 SKATE AND RAY CONSERVATION

Mr. Marklew was asked to provide a verbal report on skate and ray conservation. He advised Members that he had requested the Committee many years ago to introduce a minimum size for rays and he had brought this matter up in Committee several times since then. His concern was that very small rays were being caught and stocks being decimated. This was a totally unprotected species that did not survive in the trawl. Mr. Marklew said that he had not come to the meeting with specific recommendations but would like to see measures introduced to protect the large egg-laying females.

It was suggested that Officers be directed to look into this and report back to the Committee with recommendations for the conservation of skate and rays.

Mr. Alwyn Jones advised Members that rays had a good survival rate in the trawl and there was no perceived problem along the North Wales Coast.

12 RAZOR FISHERY – LIVERPOOL BAY

The Senior Scientific Officer presented the report informing Members of progress with surveying for razor clams. Members were advised that due to difficulties with obtaining a suitable vessel and deterioration in the weather the applicant now wished to postpone the survey work until March/April 2007.

RESOLVED

That the report be received.

The Chief Executive presented the report and reminded Members of the draft response to the DEFRA/NAW consultation which was provided at Annex A to the report. If Members had any further comments they would be included in the response. The Association of SFCs and Chief Officers Group bad also discussed this matter. Some Committees were considering the question of the addition of a maximum landing size and it was felt that to protect larger berried females could give an advantage in terms of stock benefit. With Members’ agreement Officers would include the concept of a maximum landing size set at 140mm in the response.

Mr. Gorman said he was in agreement with the draft response and the comments made apart from the addition of a maximum landing size. He felt that the higher this was set it became a self-defeating object.

Following a discussion it was

Mrs. M. Owen was asked to provide a verbal report on this matter. Mrs. Owen pointed out that the power station created its own nursery area, which was of benefit to the fishermen in the long term, but there were concerns about the number of fish being sucked through the bubble curtain. It was understood that the fish were then put in a skip and dumped on a tip. Fishery Officers presently had to give the power station two to three days’ notice of any visit to check on the fish and Mrs. Owen requested that Officers should liaise with Heysham Power Station and remind them of the Committee’s responsibilities in this respect.

The Chief Executive said he would follow this up with the power station to try to encourage them to adopt a more reliable and permanent method of keeping the fish out.

Members were advised that when permission was granted for Sizewell B power station a requirement for the construction was for the installation of a fish diversion scheme so that fish were returned directly to the sea. It was suggested that officers should follow that up and if it was found to be effective, pressure should be put on government for such a system to be installed in all power stations.

Members were updated on progress with the renewal of Fishery Orders within the District. With respect to the Conwy Mussel Fishery Order and Menai Strait (West) Orders, SFO Hughes had contacted layholders and arranged meetings in order to discuss the type of Fishery Orders required for the future.

With regard to the Morecambe Bay Fishery Order, the new Fishery Orders Development Officer had contacted local landowners asking for their initial views on the development of the Order and he was in the process of preparing a management plan.

That the report be received.

There being no further business the Chairman thanked Members for attending and declared the meeting closed at 1245 hours.